The Power of Adventure Therapy: Revolutionizing Teen Mental Health

Transcript

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 00:04
Welcome to Behind the Smiles with Dr. Sharnell Myles and Embark Behavioral Health.

Today, I’m so excited to have our guest, Mr. Derrick Bowles. He is the Executive Director of Crossroads in Ogden, Utah. Today, we’re going to sit down and talk about mental health and sports.

First, I have to start by saying—today I toured your program, and it is absolutely phenomenal. Thank you. Phenomenal. I’ve never seen or toured a therapeutic program specifically for boys quite like yours. So why don’t you start by telling us who you are and a little bit about your program?

Derrick Bowles (: 00:55
Thank you, I appreciate the opportunity. It’s really been a life’s work for my partners and me in starting Crossroads. So anytime we get the chance to show it off or let people see what we’re doing, it’s such a privilege.

Thank you for coming—on a snowy day, no less—so it kind of feels like we’re cozied up and ready for a good conversation.

We started Crossroads nearly 18 years ago. Dr. Sam Don and I met in graduate school. We went our separate ways for a time but reconnected because we shared some of the same concerns about adolescent treatment—specifically, how it was being approached for youth at the time.

At the core, we believed it was important to move away from a punitive model. We started asking ourselves, “If we had to go somewhere for help, what would we want it to look like?”

A big part of that vision came from how active our lives were—we were living adventure-based lifestyles. We believed that if we could create a place where kids who were struggling could come and experience those same kinds of things while in treatment, we could impact their lives in a meaningful way.

Honestly, I think in the beginning we were a little naïve about the level of impact it would have. Back then, the research didn’t yet support what we instinctively believed was happening. But over time, the data has come—and it’s been really profound.

So we’re primarily a substance abuse and recovery program that we’ve built around adventure-based sports. We work with youth between the ages of 14 and 17, bringing them here to Ogden, Utah—which is really a hub for outdoor adventure sports.

That was our vision when we started Crossroads. At the time, we got a lot of pushback. People were saying, “You’re going to do what? Take these kids skiing? Take them out on a lake?” There was a lot of skepticism, maybe just a lack of understanding or education about what it means to allow kids to experience some sense of normalcy—even while they’re in a place of acuity. That became a big driver for us.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 03:28
Yeah. So I’ve been here in Ogden for just about 24 hours. When I arrived, it wasn’t snowing, but I could see the snow-capped mountains. Now it is snowing—it’s absolutely beautiful here.

I like to call it a Hallmark city.

Derrick Bowles (: 03:47
For sure.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 03:57
It looks like something out of a Hallmark movie. And I don’t think, as a kid or a teenager, I could have even imagined having the opportunity to come to a place like this if I needed help—not only being thousands of miles away from home but actually wanting to come to a program like yours. That speaks volumes.

I had the opportunity to speak with some of your clients, and I was blown away. I shared that with you—I was truly blown away.

The way they described your program, the level of safety, and the therapeutic work they’re doing—you just don’t hear that often from teenagers, especially teenage boys. So talk a little bit about that. What’s the philosophy behind working with teenage boys who have substance use experiences and are away from home—but who are enjoying doing the therapeutic work?

Derrick Bowles (: 04:59
I’m so glad you picked up on that.

From the beginning, our design philosophy was: “What would it look like if we had to go?” Every decision—down to the rooms, the lighting, the pool table, the ping pong table—was made with that question in mind. We’d ask, “Would this help make the experience better?” If so, it stayed.

That’s how we designed Crossroads—from a mindset of removing the punitive aspects. Instead of restricting or punishing, we asked, “What do you like to do?” Let’s just start there.

Take skateboarding, for example. Traditionally, skateboarders have been seen as part of a counterculture—kids who don’t totally fit in. Now imagine them going to a place that says, “Not only do we see you, we support you in that.” The difference that makes on day one is huge.

They walk through the door and think, “I like this. You see me.” And not just in some generic way—you see me because you recognize what I like to do.

That’s powerful. And what we’ve realized—what’s ultimately most important in this process—is: can we create real, connected relationships?

If you can connect with young people—and if you're genuine about it—that changes the entire treatment process from day one. I'm not spending 60 days just trying to get them to trust me. They somewhat trust me from the start because I’ve got an Independent sweatshirt on, I’m wearing some J’s, and I do what they do. Even though I’m 50, I can still go bomb a mountain with them. There’s a connection there. That’s made a huge difference.

We're saving a ton of time by not having to fight that battle up front. Most kids want to be home, right? And as clinicians, as providers in this field, if we could do all this work at home, we would. We want to get them home as soon as it makes sense. But when that’s not working, we try to create something that feels as close to home as possible. That’s really driven how we designed Crossroads and how we work with these young guys.

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Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 07:02
Yeah.

Yeah.

You briefly touched on the relationship aspect. At Embark, we do a ton of experiential work with boys, girls, teens, and young adults. But at the heart of it is developmental and systems work. We really focus on relationships—not just the therapeutic relationship, but also their relationships with caregivers, parents, or whoever is in their support system. We know the science behind sound therapeutic relationships and how they create change.

Can you talk a little more about that, especially in terms of therapeutic work and really honing in on the relationship?

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Derek Bowles (: 08:15
You bet. That idea of affecting someone’s life—sitting across from another person and trying to help them change something difficult—that has to start with trust. Can you trust me? Can we be connected?

There are a lot of ways to build that connection, and I think you should be savvy in using all of them. For us, one of the simplest ways has been doing what they do. For a 17-year-old to sit across from someone they just snowboarded with—to have shared that flow state—that’s powerful.

At first, we didn’t even realize how profound that would be. We thought we were just giving them new adventures, new experiences, some natural highs. We knew we wanted to build relationships, but we couldn’t have predicted how good the work would be after that. And now, as you mentioned, research is helping us understand why.

We can now map the brain and understand the role of dopamine. When you have a shared dopamine dump—that’s why people love vacations with family. Those shared experiences bond us. And we’re doing that here, just amped up. We’re engaging in adventure sports that produce high levels of dopamine, norepinephrine, and serotonin. That creates more connected relationships.

That connection gives us permission to challenge them. It allows us to say, “That’s not working,” or “That’s going to cause problems,” and it's not met with resistance. It’s not, “You don’t understand me, so you don’t get to say that.” Instead, it’s, “Let me think about that.” That’s especially powerful with adolescent boys—those with oppositional defiant disorder or ADD. This becomes a backdoor way to break through the resistance. And it’s been incredibly effective.

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Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 10:46
Yeah, yeah. Let’s stay there for a minute.

We were talking earlier—I think I mentioned that I’m a bit of a daredevil. I’ll try almost anything. I don’t have much experience skiing, but when it comes to water sports, I’m all in. If I haven’t done it before, I’ll probably try it. There’s a natural fear, right? A healthy fear.

Now think about the kids you’re serving. These are kids sliding down mountains, snowboarding—without poles—just going for it. Some of them are doing tricks. Even when I watch that on TV, I’m like, “Wow.”

There has to be a certain level of excitement, nerve, and fearlessness. But on the flip side, these are teens who might be struggling in a regular setting, where they don’t need the same skill set—or maybe they do. So how do you explain that? How do you make sense of that?

Derek Bowles (: 12:14
There are two processes here that I think are really, really important. One is that it's the nature of a lot of their wiring to be impulsive, to be risk-seeking. What we know about ADD, ADHD, and what we know a little bit about processing splits, is that there’s this lack of executive functioning that leads to...

"I hate being bored." In fact, we now know that boredom physically causes stress for kids with ADD. They physically feel pain when they’re bored. So what happens is they become adventure-seeking—or as we say in therapy, risk-seeking. But really, they’re just looking to shift how they feel or what’s going on for them.

So maybe they do something exciting. Maybe they try a substance. Maybe they steal something or cause a problem. What we want to do is take that same impulse—that same desire—and channel it into something productive. Something that isn’t maladaptive. Meaning, when they do it, there aren’t negative consequences.

Now, there might be some physical consequences—you break a collarbone or a wrist—but those things are fixable. Compare that to crime, substance use, and the side effects of addiction. So we want to take what they come wired with and help them connect it with something adaptive instead of maladaptive.

That does something really powerful. We know that one of the key components of motivation is mastery. I've got to get good at something. And if I'm in the process of getting good at something, I’m more motivated to keep doing it.

My office has a big window that looks out over our skate features. I remember doing a session with a set of parents. I was on the phone, and I watched a kid out the back window try a trick—over and over. I saw him for 30 minutes trying the same trick. I watched him get frustrated. I could tell he was swearing. I saw him smack the board. But then, I saw him land the trick.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 14:07
Mm-hmm.

Derek Bowles (: 14:34
And he threw his arms up. He skated around—no one was around, he was out there by himself—but he nailed the trick and threw his arms up. I could just feel how elated he was from across the yard. And you know what he did next? He went right back and tried a new trick—the same one, but in reverse. He wanted to do it backwards.

That struck me. Because everywhere else in this kiddo’s life, he might not have that kind of distress tolerance. But right here, he’s learning a skill that we want to talk about in therapy—and he’s learning it by trying that trick. So we’re tapping into his ability to build mastery, a sense of self, and motivation—through a sport he wants to do.

That becomes a powerful lesson. I did a session with him and said, “Listen, you can do hard things. You can do your schoolwork. It’s frustrating, but you can do it if you stick with it.”

Those are the kinds of lessons that recreation and sports can teach in ways very few other things can.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 15:46
Yeah, yeah. So most of the boys who come to your program may have some experience in sports or what have you. Talk about the effectiveness of this type of therapy with kids who may not have any experience with sports. Where are they? What does discharge look like for them? What kind of skill set are they able to build through this therapeutic program and carry with them when they return home?

Derek Bowles (: 16:16
Yeah—go with me here and imagine a kiddo who’s at home and hasn’t done much. He’s 15, 16, and never really played team sports. He never made the team. Maybe because of that, he didn’t have a strong friend group. Maybe he put on a little weight. Maybe he just never saw himself as an athlete.

Then that kid starts using substances for the first time—and suddenly, he has a friend. Some of those friend groups—and even some of our sports—can be counterculture. You’ve got kids who skateboard or snowboard, and there's a draw there. But oftentimes those kids aren’t skating—they’re just walking around with their boards, smoking too much or using too much.

Then that kid comes to us, and for the first time in his life, he’s around a group of adults and young adults who are doing these sports—and they’re making space for him. He doesn’t have to be great at it.

I’d say less than a third of the kids who come into Crushers have ever been on a board of any kind—or have mountain biked or rock climbed. They’re not doing this in cities like Chicago or New York. So you’ve got a kid who’s never done any of that, and suddenly, for the first time, he’s doing well at something. He’s getting better at something. He’s developing a sense of self through achievement in a sport—something he can take home with him.

He can take a skateboard and ride in the city. He can find a mountain bike trail in a city park. There are tons of indoor climbing gyms now. These are things he’s never been exposed to, never would have tried. And just by trying—that’s all we ask.

We’re not saying you need experience. We’re just asking you to be willing to try. And in the back of our heads, we’re thinking, “Let’s go.”

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 17:43
Right.

Derek Bowles (: 18:10
Because we’re going to expose you to things you’ve never done before. You’ll be on a mountain lake learning to wake surf or wakeboard, or you’ll go mountain biking in places you never imagined. And we’ll start at your skill level. Just this week, we had a brand-new student who had never been on skis. He spent the whole morning on the lower bunny hill, which is what we call it.

I promise you, by the end of the day, his excitement level, his "stoke," was equal to my guys doing backflips. So it allows us to meet them where they’re at, but the outcome can be just as amazing as if they had been doing it for years.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 18:55
Yeah, yeah. Listening to you speak, a few words keep resonating with me: experience, relationships, attunement— which is a big one— and exposure. I think about my own experience at a very early age. It was exposure that, I believe, has kept me here today. Just being exposed to different cultures, people, and opportunities. Unfortunately, a lot of our teens don’t experience that.

Derek Bowles (: 19:37
Exactly.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 19:46
They don’t experience that. So, for you to have developed this program, still going strong 19 years later, and to have families literally knocking at your door because they see and understand the benefits, that’s awesome. We know something is working. We know the program is working.

Derek Bowles (: 20:10
100%.

When a parent calls us, we’re talking about the opportunity, and they see the value. Now, imagine that same kid sitting in the basement, and mom and dad have tried a lot of things to get them outdoors, but it’s been hard. It’s tough for parents because when we invite our kids to do these things, they see it as criticism. “Mom and dad want me to do this because they think I should.” So they naturally resist. But when we talk to a parent and say, “Listen, we can take them exactly where they’re at. Even if they haven’t done it, give us a few months, and they’ll be skiing,” that can be a lifeline for parents who haven’t had other options. And here’s the flat-out truth: You cannot ski or snowboard while on your phone. You can have someone filming, which can be fun, but you can’t do both. You can’t be stuck in the world of social media and live an adventure-based life. You have to give that up to experience that. In today’s culture, that’s profound. And yes, they’ll know they don’t have their phones.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 21:03
Yeah, absolutely. Do the boys know that coming in?

Derek Bowles (: 21:40
To be honest, that’s a big thing. Think about all the kids who have total meltdowns or even put holes in the walls because they can’t have their phone.

Derek Bowles (: 21:50
I’ve had kids choose another program because they could have their phones for the first month. That was the deciding factor. I’m like, “We’re going to do all these things,” but they want their phone. It is a challenge. But, like the kiddos you met today, they’re not asking for their phones. They’re asking, “Let’s go ride. Let’s get on the mountain.” And that shift, that change in mindset, doesn’t take long. It just takes exposure and creating that adventure-based mindset, which pulls them away from the constant phone attachment.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 22:14
Yeah, and if you want to take it a step further, even with phones, we focus on technology and mental health. The use of technology can now be looked at as an addictive behavior, much like substance use. When you talk about the brain and addiction, there are some very similar components. Being able to tackle both of those is key.

Derek Bowles (: 22:50
And we don’t have to explicitly say, “It’s about your phone.” I just tell them, “You can’t go do the thing with your phone.” So it becomes a way to work through that resistance. But I do think there’s a space for moderation. We live in a technological world, and we’re going to have kids who...

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 22:52
There you go.

Derek Bowles (: 23:16
The goal is to help them manage that, but you don't do it by simply saying "no." You manage it by offering opportunities that they can't get through the phone. I think that long-term, this will be the real difference maker. You see this in adults too—those who live adventure-based lives aren't stuck on their phones. They'll take a picture at the end and maybe post about it, but for the eight hours they spent doing the activity, they're not glued to their phones.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 23:46
If you're like me, you're handing it to someone on the side to say, "Can you record me?" or take wedding photos, right?

Derek Bowles (: 23:53
Yeah. And there's something really powerful about that connection—someone filming you doing something. As adults or as therapists, if we're on the mountain and film a trick, then stop and watch it together, we're not stuck on the phone. We're building a connection between the accomplishment and the experience. I try to encourage families to use technology to connect, instead of being afraid of it. We need balance, and that’s what’s missing. The phone itself isn’t the problem; it’s how long they’re on it.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 24:37
You mentioned families and connecting. Talk to me about the effectiveness of involving the family in treatment, even when they’re thousands of miles away. Do you do this virtually? Do you have parents visit? How do parents really engage in adventure therapy the way you’re doing it?

Derek Bowles (: 25:02
It can be a roadblock. We want to help parents, but they're not always as able to do it as we are. However, they can still engage—they can go on family ski trips or try other activities. What matters is helping parents embrace and encourage their kids in that process. It’s powerful for parents to be excited about their child’s accomplishments and to see that without judgment, letting them do their thing. None of this works unless we engage the family system. That’s where the real connection happens.

It allows us to align with both the parents and the student, saying, "Let’s fix the family system." Maybe it's not all the kid's fault, but if they trust me, I can help their parents see things differently. If parents feel they have an ally who sees them in context, we can challenge their maladaptive thinking or parenting style. The biggest gift for parents is when the child says, "I trust this person." That creates an instant allyship and opens the door to the family system. Once we’re aligned, we can challenge unhealthy patterns, which ultimately changes the outcomes. If we skip this step, the kid comes home and is left just with a skateboard—and that’s not enough.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 26:58
Yes, and in programs like Embark, the family system is at the heart of the work we do. Without it, you’d just have the kid coming home with a skateboard—or a K9, or something else. How do you support families when there’s resistance? What happens if parents don’t want to get involved, maybe just dropping their child off and taking a phone call here and there?

Derek Bowles (: 27:48
It’s similar to working with a resistant kid. We need to build the relationship, so I might have to do a lot of hand-holding. That means consistently engaging the family, providing information that shows how things are changing. I have to roll with their resistance and challenge unhealthy interactions when necessary. Sometimes we have to do the harder work, but I’ve found that most parents, if they believe the relationship with their child is there, it invites them into that relationship too.

Building that relationship with the child often vicariously builds it with the parents. But sometimes we have to meet resistance head-on. We want a lot of exposure to the family system early on. In the first 90 days, we ask parents to visit as much as possible—spending weekends together. We do pre- and post-therapy sessions to give feedback and coaching. After that, in the long-term program, we have monthly visits, with time increasing as the child prepares to go home. By the final visit, we want the situation to be as close to home life as possible—curfews, rules, chores. We aim for a self-driven dynamic without much therapeutic input. If the child can handle challenges like curfew on their own, we know we’re getting close. It’s hard work, but it’s been very effective.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 30:01
So I'm sitting here thinking, you know, again, it's very experiential for the client, experiential for the parent. Are the parents going hiking? Are they skiing? Are they snowboarding? What an amazing opportunity, even for the client, maybe to see their parent fail at something, right? And then keep working at it until they get it, or the family coming together to succeed at something experiential. How powerful.

Derek Bowles (: 30:40
That's it. Just to come out and say— and that's what we'll say oftentimes—we don't want to fix anything this weekend. We want you to build some sort of memory. Go to Park City, go ski together, go do that hike. Let him show you what he's doing. Take him to the skate park and let him show you what he's been doing. We just want you to start building connected memories. We'll get to the hard stuff, but that's the start of it. It's always a bonus. A lot of our families, I think, have the resources and access to do a lot of these things. And what I'll hear sometimes is, "This is the first time he hasn't fought us." For the last three years, he's fought us on every ski trip, and he went down every run and didn't complain this time. That’s when we say, "We got our kid back." So, it's still in the adventure that they’re building the memories and connections. And that's been really cool to see.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 31:34
I love hearing you say that it's in the adventure that they build the memory and connection. Because we also say, you know, people don't heal just by talking. Healing happens through experience.

Derek Bowles (: 31:52
Yes, yes. So, it’s the experience.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 31:55
Exactly.

Derek Bowles (: 31:56
You bet, you bet. And those experiences, think— partly from the adventure-based stuff into now we’re talking about school, and we’re getting through school. We're talking about relationship stuff. It can start with one good day on the mountain, which can spark some really good conversations. And I think that’s true for us in our work, and I do think it’s true for families.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 32:12
So, where do you see sports and mental health going? Because, again, oftentimes sports and mental health, you know, we hear, "Okay, the sports psychologist, basketball or whatever," but this is different. You've created something very different. So where do you see sports and mental health going?

Derek Bowles (: 32:30
Yeah, I think sports, in particular for adolescents, even team sports, is the gateway. I think it's an arena where we can address mental health in a way that the adolescent will allow us. Whether it’s a little bit of sports psychology...

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 32:40
Say that again.

Derek Bowles (: 32:41
So, it’s the gateway that allows the adolescent to give us permission to engage with them. If you say to a kid, "I want you to go see a therapist," they’re like, "What are you talking about?" But if it's in the midst of sports, and you’re seeing anxiety and say, "I want you to work with a sports psychologist to get better at your sport," they’ll say, "Yeah, okay." So it can be an avenue that allows us to engage. And I think it’s a place where parents can say, "Yeah, that makes sense." So, it’s both on the front end, allowing us to engage, but also on the treatment side. I don’t see a future in mental health that doesn’t include experiential therapy or treatment. You’ve got to be doing some sort of recreation or exercise, whatever it might be. So for adolescents, an adventure-based sport is the exercise we want because we know it will change the brain. We’re not getting them to do jumping jacks, but we can get them to ride a hill. So, not only is it the gateway to engage them and give us permission, but it can also be part of the treatment. And at Crossroads, the adventure-based sports we’ve been doing have been just as important to treatment in healing brains, building confidence, and building a sense of self, as any talk therapy we’ve done.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 34:07
Absolutely. And it is knocking out stigma.

Derek Bowles (: 34:10
Yes. And that's why I said it again. Because, again, when you have teens who say, "This is what I want," and they are making the decision, they're not fighting us anymore about therapy or even sometimes, you know, taking medication, which is, most of the time, for some teens, a big fight. But they are taking treatment. They’re taking their own mental health into their hands and owning it. You know, in my conversation with some of your students, I asked, "What are you going to do when you're discharged? Do you want to come back here?" Every last one of them said, "I'm coming back here to work." I said, "Oh, really?" And they said, "Yeah, I’m coming back here to work." They talked about the benefits, not just the sports part, but about how their mental health is changing. It was profound to hear a room of boys, teenage boys, say, "No, I’m on the same team. I want to come back here, and I not only want to work, but I want to be a resource for another boy or teenager who’s coming behind me, struggling with their mental health or substance use."

Derek Bowles (: 35:29
What a change that would be in context to our field as a whole, right? I mean, we're all experiencing, and some of it, rightfully so, the unproductive treatment styles that kids 20 years ago experienced. I mean, we’re all seeing some kids who’ve had treatment that traumatized them. So, as an industry, if we're not all taking a hard look at what that was or is, then it’s probably a shame. But, in that though, to have kids right now—my kids—right now I have 10 past students working for me. They're not on Reddit complaining about their experiences. They're here giving back. And to have current kids who aren’t saying, "This is miserable, and I hate this, and you guys are child trafficking me," or these horrendous things, but they're genuinely saying, "No, I’m better today than I was two weeks ago or a month ago," that’s something we all could look at and ask, how do we do more of that? And so for me, if it’s through sports, if it’s through the connection in sports, what do I care if a kid says, "I have a sports psychologist" or "I have a therapist"? To me, I can do the same work. You can call me a coach, you can call me a thousand things, but if you allow me to help you with your mental health, let’s go through that. So, yeah, the stigma, the idea that I have a say in it, that this could help me in different ways. Because we’ve put mental health into a compartment over here, but no, it is about your athletics. It’s about your academics. It’s about your relationships. Let’s address it across all of those domains. I think that's the way to the adult.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 37:12
Yeah, it's about being empowered. It's about being empowered to own your future and your journey.

Derek Bowles (: 37:35
Well, I think cost is a barrier for a lot of folks. Running a program is expensive. We're all looking at how we can do things more effectively and efficiently. The days of 18-month treatment programs are gone. We're being asked to do things faster and more effectively, and that's okay—we can rise to that challenge.

Cost will always be a barrier, and with that comes insurance. Being in Utah, there are a lot of folks who are out of network, but with our short-term process, we've found we can cross that barrier much better. A lot of things are covered by insurance, and longer periods of stay are covered now, which is a big benefit.

I do think there’s still some unawareness about what can be offered at a residential treatment center. When I talk to parents about what we do, it’s so different from what they expect treatment to be. Once parents hear what we offer, they’re often shocked and say, "Are you kidding me? I want to sign up!" When I talk to the students, there's much less resistance. I'll tell them, "You’ll arrive on Monday, we’ll ski on Tuesday morning, play pickleball on Wednesday, rock climb Thursday, and by Friday, you’ll be exhausted." It’s so different from the old idea of treatment, where it’s all about sessions and no fun.

We’ve created a really comfortable environment. We want it to feel like home, not a sterile, hospital-like atmosphere. The closer we can make it feel like home, the better. But the stigma around residential treatment still exists, both for kids and parents, and that's something we have to overcome.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 40:04
Absolutely. There’s still a lot of work to be done in helping society reimagine therapy—what it is and what it can be. We also need to collaborate to break down stigma and address barriers like insurance and payment. There’s more work to be done.

Derek Bowles (: 40:37
I think collaboration is key. Being able to work with programs across the country has helped us find some solutions. I can share what we’ve learned, and we can share with each other how we’ve overcome struggles. Collaboration is really important. There’s enough work to go around—we don’t need to fight each other, we can help each other. I appreciate your excitement about what we’re doing and your desire to learn more.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 41:15
Absolutely. So, what’s the one thing you want teens and parents to know about sports and mental health? If you had to give a closing line, what would it be?

Derek Bowles (: 41:31
I’d go back to the idea that you can have normalcy through acuity. You can be struggling with addiction or mental health, and still have adventure-based experiences. You can experience joy, even through hard things. For me, providing those opportunities while still doing the hard work is the collaboration we all need in life. Life is tough, and we all look forward to those days when we can get up on the mountain or go on vacation. We haven’t done the best job in treatment providing those same experiences while kids deal with the hardest things in their lives. If we can create more normalcy and adventure through acuity, we’ll be doing good. That’s what I want to share—I want to go through this hard thing with you, but let’s also have some fun and jump off some stuff.

Dr. Sharnell Myles (: 42:37
Let’s have some fun, yeah. That’s a perfect way to close. You said it—let’s climb the mountain, have fun, re-imagine the process, and do the hard work while also having fun. I appreciate your time, and the work you’re doing at Crossroads is amazing. We could have talked for hours, especially about the skate shop, which we didn’t even get to, but your outcomes speak for themselves. That’s what matters most—sustainable change and healing. Thank you again.

Derek Bowles (: 43:37
It was so much fun. Thank you.